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How Much is Too Much?

Posted By: Randy GageAugust 27, 2010

Take a look at that question in the headline again.  Bet you’ve heard that more than a few times.  But picture this…

Someone says, “Just look at that George!  He has perfect health.   High energy, no diseases, and he hasn’t even had a sniffle in months.  Don’t you hate greedy people like that?  Poor Elizabeth has the flu, and George is hogging all the health!”

You’d never say that about health.  Or love.  Or happiness.  So why would you say it about money?

-RG

96 comments on “How Much is Too Much?”

  1. Well I know my church and the M.O.R.E. project wishes I had more.

    I really don't think you can have too much. What's worse to much in the wrong hands or to little in the wrong hands?

    It's what you do with what you got that matters and that is a personal thing.

    Vincent

  2. ....Because money comes FROM other people, and health does not.

    I've heard you make this comparison before, and it never made sense to me- I'm not being confrontational- I'd like you to help me understand how they are comparable.

    I understand that you believe money is inexhaustible, like kisses or health, but that just doesn't quite square with reality.

    Money is something you get from other people, and health is not- that's where I see the difference, and that's the answer I see to your question.

    1. At one time there was no money! Now there is many, many, many Trillions in the world. It is all created. The more someone creates the more there is for everyone else. If I have a piece of land that is worth £10,000 and build a hotel on it. I use material that costs £100,000 but the hotel and land combined is worth £500,000. So I have just created a £390,000 increase in my net worth that didn't come from anyone else.

      1. I learned the value of land a long time ago. Especially when a building goes on it afterwards. There will always be a market for land. But good luck finding a piece of land in the UK for only 10000 Pounds.

      2. W David C - I your posts about value and wealth and they were right on the money. A great explanation of percieved value et al. You would have made a great eceonomics professor.

    2. I think David explained this pretty good. The other thing to keep in mind is that when money comes FROM other people, it's because they chose to spend it with you. They want the value you offer. And all prosperity is a value for value exchange.

      Now they can choose their value foolishly (buying lottery tickets for example) or prudently. But it is always their choice.

      -RG

      1. Randy, I believe we have money mixed up with paper wealth and (perceived) value.

        David added 390,000 of perceived value. It only becomes money, when a buyer takes coins and bank notes from his wallet, and transfers it to David. Which leaves the money supply unchanged.

        Money (as in coins and bank notes) is finite, unless you print more. You can't create it without devaluing it. Just ask Ben Bernanke. What you can create out of thin air though, is paper wealth and/or value.

        Did the creation of Facebook create $15 billion in tangible money? Or is it just paper wealth untill already existing money changes hands?

        Or do you see flaws in this reasoning?

        Cheers, Robert

        1. Money is simply a meme created by man. Of course governments printing more every time they overspend devalues it. But in the real economy, the value is determined by what people are willing to trade it for.

          -RG

          1. OK, and how does that make money infinite?

            I get the concept of infinite ideas which create value, but infinite money?

            Robert

        2. By building the hotel I added value that wasn't there before. I can refinance the hotel and take out £300,000 cash and circulate it into the economy and then the people I spend it with will have enhanced the the quality of my life with their products and service. Then they can use it get value from other peoples products and services.

          Many Billions are being printed every day, which causes inflation, an incremental decrease in the value of each note. But everyone is better off because if the land was a waste ground that was nasty looking has been turned into something beautiful it also adds value to all the properties in the area and everyone wins.

          All money was printed to represent perceived value. That is why more and more is made because we are all adding value with every product and service that we produce. So with every passing year the quality of all our lives are improved.

          Money is just an idea and always based on perceived value. Currency was initially used to represent the value of Gold held in a Bank, but since that was removed it is just based on the trust that the economy of the country can pay it all back. (as cash is just IOU's)

          Wealth is all about the speed at which money circulates in the economy so we can use it to produce value!

          1. If you get a loan from the bank, because the bank perceives your hotel to be sufficient collateral, how does that make money infinite?

            Sure, you created value on paper, on which you haven taken out a loan. Like a home equity loan.

            How does getting a loan make money infinite?

            - Robert

    3. That sounds to me like you are coming from a position of scarcity, that if you acquire more it means that someone else can't have that money. There is truly no scarcity, there is abundance in everything, including money.

    4. At it's essence. moeny is an idea, as is good health and happiness. And ideas leave not there source. Also, keep in mind that more money has been printed and circulated in the last 36 months than in all the previous years combined. And more is printed every day. There's plenty for everyone, completely dependent on one's consciousness.

      1. Wow! I love that this convo got going- But yes, we are talking about the difference between MONEY (Which is represented with dollars and coins) and VALUE (which is arbitrary, and completely subjective).

        I understand they you can always add perceived VALUE to something, and people can choose to use their money to acquire that value you have created.

        However, that means that MONEY only comes FROM someone else, and that they are not buying actual value, but ALWAYS perceived value.

        When you set a price on something, it has nothing to do with the actual value. Money is supposed to be the exchange medium between products and services that a buyer PERCEIVES will help him, but it is not that at all anymore.

        Now it's some kind of "score" we keep in theory based on what "value" you've given society- but it is not that in experience or practice.

        So after all of that, making the difference between value and money- HOW is it that Money is equal to health?

        It seems like VALUE might be more like Health? Is that more along the line? Someone wouldn't say "Gosh, he provides so much value!" as a negative...

        1. Reply to Robert and Bones

          Money is actually anything that can be traded (cows, chickens, cars, bricks, knowledge, skills etc) that is why it is infinite. What we now call money is just currency. Currency (notes and 0's in a bank account) is just IOU's based on perceived value. It is written on them 'I promise to pay the bearer on demand' because it was originally backed by gold. So you could use the note to pick up your gold anytime you want and this saved us carrying it and preventing theft. Now it is just an IOU based on trust that the value will stay the same. The amount of IOU's that can be written is infinite.

          It is not and never has been based on actual value, because such a thing does not exist. In a boom it appears that there is more money going around because people perceive everything to be worth more and has trust that more will come around. Almost everyone with property has a rise in their net worth even tho nothing has changed.

          In a recession it appears that there is less going around because everyone perceives everything to be worth less, they get scared and stop circulating it as quickly. Almost everyone with property has a decrease in there net worth even tho nothing has changed. It is based on trust, oversupply, undersupply and fear of lack

          If we all sit in a room and write IOU's for each other based on what we think each other is worth it will not be dependent on any real value but just the perceived value of each person. Knowledge, skills and ideas are infinite so the IOU's that can be printed to represent these is infinite.

          The amount of wealth we have depends on how much perceived value we can create. Not on any real value because real value would have to be compared to something, but nothing has a fixed value. It is always changing.

          1. David - that's an amazing perspective on the topic of value. Quite a paradigm shift too, needs some digesting but it resonates! Thanks for sharing!

    5. I agree with you Rodriguez, there is only a set amount of money printed, it is finite, if few people have lots, than many people have little, this is an imbalance in society.

      All the "interest" on money that is owing in the world, does not physically exist, therefore for you to "get ahead" and pay out the interest owing on your house for example, this is leaving a shortfall in the money pit, it is impossible for the world to pay all debt, the money just does not exist.

      If we all lived a simpler life without greed perhaps they may intime become a balance in the world, without extremes of wealth and poverty. Idealistic, yes, but it starts with each one of us.

  3. I enjoy meeting people who have great health, lots of love and are happy people. I do run into people who believe healthy people are lucky or they are unlucky because they are sick. I have met people who are envious of others love. I know that some people who are divorced do not like to socialize with my wife an I becuase we are in love and happily married. Great though provoking post Randy.

    Thanks,

    Paul

  4. For me, it's the choices we make and the thoughts we think.

    If we CHOOSE to think those type of thoughts, we need to be accountable for the outcome. As far as I'm concerned, there's no limit to the amount of money, health or anything else available to us, so why make such a statement?

  5. Why do wee say it about money? Who knows. It could be jelousy. It could be conditioning. By conditioning we have many conflicted ideas about money. You have most people - when they are a young age - being told by religion to abandon material things and how wonderful it would be to walk around in sandals. You also have the media portraying wealthy people as bastards. You're never taught or instructed about the practicality or how to handle money. Most of us have never been taught how think and go in business for ourselves. We've been conditioned to work for others - school does a good job of that.

  6. There are so many bizarre, weird and silly ideas about money. Your example is perfect.

    When your fortune is attracted in harmony with universal forces there is no such thing as too much.

    Ryan Biddulph

  7. In essence, no one really forced you to buy anything!

    As well as you can be prosperous and wealthy whatever you do,

    it is not necessarily about how much you make,

    but how much you keep when everything is paid,

    and what you do with that money.

    10 000 dollars is really 2.4 million dollars over 30 years with annual 20% increase. That's how Warren Buffet looks at 10 000 dollars.

    Generally, people who have abandonment issues have the same with money and material things.

    Again, it is vital to RELEASE issues, and there are various techniques for that. Visualize!

    We have all heard about "emptying the cup" if it's already full. That's what release means.

    And the more you do out of love and respect, the more you will have with which to work. This is Universal Law!

    1. Just curious...what makes you think one has to keep it? Holding onto money comes from the limiting belief that the flow will or could stop. Oxygen is the most precious commodity. Are you holding onto your breath, saving for later? What if you had a cosmic overdraft protection account where all that you needed always showed up, for the rest of your life? Consciousness, through Spirit, is our Source for everything, including money.

        1. The size of our savings determine the size of our opportunities. If we have 0 in savings and someone offers us a job at £100 per day we will be excited about it. If we have £1000 in savings and we are offered a job at £100 per day (10% of our money) we will be feeling OK about it. If we have £10,000 in savings and we are offered £100 per day we will have less motivation to do it. If we have £100,000 in saving then the motivation to add 0.01% will be very small. If we have £1,000,000 in savings then to add 0.001% will be very, very small.

          So if we have a large amount our minds will create bigger opportunities to create the same level of motivation in the first example. £1,000,000 in savings will lead to £1,000,000 opportunities.

  8. Randy...I get that you are fighting the "memes" out there that say that all rich people are greedy. That's a worthy fight. But I think it's not intellectually sound to seriously equate it to having optimal health or love. You can't be greedy with personal health or devotion. Over the ages, riches have quite often come at the expense of others. We are now in a new age (I believe) where an exchange of value for money has created a relationship to wealth or prosperity that is different from the past. But greed is the pursuit of riches has not died out. Millions ARE oppressed by others pursuing greed...which I define as money-generating actions that harm, take advantage of, or hoodwink others. The financial markets have had many of these. I abhor victim-hood and support your efforts wholeheartedly for people to stand up and take responsibility for their decisions. Having said that...I don't think we can claim that greed is good or that greed has gone away as a factor in society.

      1. I think there are some serious lack and limiting beliefs being expressed here and a definite energy to repel money. Please think about that and I will pick up here on another post.

        -RG

        1. That's why I asked; I keep hearing things that just don't equate with what I perceive as reality, so I'd like to see the other side of the curtain.

          So- "Money is found in other people's pockets" (Dan Kennedy), but Health is not- so I am looking for in what ways you see it differently.

          1. This is EXACTLY the kind of song you would write with your beliefs about money. No wonder you like it! We have a lot of work to do on the next post...

            -RG

    1. Greed is not the same as wanting a lot of wealth. Greed is wanting a lot of wealth and not being willing to give fair value in exchange for it. If you have an infinite amount of fair value to trade, then wealth is infinite. If you are limited in what you have to offer, then your potential for wealth is limited. I believe that limitation is set by you. There are VERY FEW people who are incapable of finding a way to increase what they have to offer. there are a LOT of people unwilling to put the effort into doing so.

      1. KH, I agree. I love the way Nancy said it.

        And to tie in my understanding from what David said earlier about all value being perceived value since there is no such thing as real value as things are always changing - it would equate then, if you take that premise to be true, that money is indeed infinite because it is dependent on the amount of perceived value we are willing to give in return.

        And since we are fully creative beings, our inherent value is thus infinite, so we will always have unlimited value to exchange for more of whatever we want.

        The question then would be, how relevant & pervasive is the perceived value you are offering now in context to today's world? Because if we follow this line of thinking, how can it be too much? There is no basis for comparison & to validate that. It is already infinite.

        Amazing content in this post. Thanks guys.

  9. People can be say that about money because money is tangible. You can’t physically hold health or love or happiness.

    There are no fine lines with money. Either you have it or you don’t. On the other hand, you can have different degrees of health and happiness.

    While there may be differing levels of what people believe it means to be successful, rich, or wealthy, money is something that most people having trouble being content with because they know that there is physically more out there for them to have and get. Since there is always more and since it is a tangible experience, it is easy to compare with others, which creates more desire. Health and happiness cannot be physically comparable because they are not cut and dry experiences and objects like money.

  10. As Bob Proctor would say "When the source is infinite no one can take more than their share". The source is infinite. Whoever understands it gets whatever they want and they are fair enough to tell everyone that the source is infinite. Those who don't understand it doesn't care to receive whats on offer.

      1. Look at what needs to be done. Shouldn't hold back from direct experience. Set your total concentration at the task at hand. Be practical and innovative. Test and refine your ideas of the value that you want to deliver. You deliver value when you do something with a lot of passion. It's something that starts from within.

        1. A painting is a perfect example of infinite wealth. The Mona Lisa was once a blank canvass and a vision. Now it is probably worth hundreds of millions. All based on perceived value. It is still just a canvass with some paint but because so many value the painting it could be traded for almost anything.

          Wealth is just perceived value of what we have to trade. So it is infinite and can not stop anyone else from having what they want. Because they can create something with an idea that can be worth huge wealth.

          1. Um..... the question is not "Is wealth infinite?"- that's what you are answering, but- no one asked that.

            The question is why would you equate money and health....

            Someone CANNOT take someone's health.
            You CAN take someone's money.

            Every time you increase your own money supply (printing money excluded), it is taking from someone else's.

            That's what it is designed to do.

            Yes, I buy a book, and I give $10 for that- I understand that I perceive that I have traded fairly perceived value for perceived value, but my MONEY is decreased.

            So- the painting has increased the VALUE of the canvas, and has increased the enjoyment of it for people everywhere, but it has NOT increased the money for it- it is TRADED for something else.

          2. Bones,

            Robert asked how does getting a loan make money infinite? So I was answering that.

            If by taking money from another you are talking about stealing or corruption then it can be equated to health very easily. I could poison you or cut your leg off and therefore take your health. Same as I could steal your money.

            If you are talking about fair, unforced exchange then your money/ wealth has not decreased only your IOU's/ currency. But you actually have more money (money is actually anything that can be traded, not the notes) because you have traded something you value less for something you value more. At that point you valued the $10 less than you valued the Book. So your wealth has been increased by doing the trade.

            It is like you traded with me 2 of your chickens for 8 of my fish. You would only trade the chickens if you felt you were better off with the fish than with the chickens. It is just that instead of carrying around the chickens you carry around a note that represents the chickens in a safe location. That note tells me I can pick up the chickens anytime I want or else trade the IOU for something else at a market (e,g a coat). Then the person I give your IOU to can go and get the chickens whenever he wants or trade it for something else.

            Currency which we get confused with money is an IOU that has 'I promise to pay the bearer on demand' written on it. That means you promise to pay me with your chickens when I hand in the IOU at a later date. Wealth is the stuff we have that can be traded. The IOUs are only worth what the person thinks the stuff you have is worth. All perceived value.

            Paper currency was just created to make trade easier but has no value in and of itself. It is just worthless paper unless it is backed by something. So the more we have to back up the value the more IOUs we will have to trade.

            So we create our own health and in the same way we can create our own tradable products and services. Health and wealth come from ideas and action not from taking from others.

          3. No- if you poison me, it decreases my health, but does NOT increase yours as a result.

            No- In the fish and chicken example, the trade is supposed to be EQUAL- just as I am valuing one more than the other, so are you- the trade is EQUAL That is what money is for- an EXCHANGE.

            Yes, I understand that currency and money are just ideas and pieces of paper that represent IOUs.

          4. Good point Bones,

            So a better example regarding health would be that I kidnap you and steal your heart to transplant it into my body because yours is healthier.

            In the trading the chickens and fish example of course I would not trade with you if I did not feel that I was better off with your chickens than my fish. We both have to feel we win or we would not trade.

            Also on the inflation point you made earlier, printing more money decreasing the value of all money is the same as saying that every time your chickens lay an egg and more chickens grow it devalues all other chickens. Supply and demand.
            But the number of available chickens will have increased so all buyers of chickens are better off.

            Randy Wrote
            You’d never say that about health. Or love. Or happiness. So why would you say it about money?

            He didn't say 'So why would you say that about currency/ IOU's'
            Currency/ notes are only potential money until converted into real money (products and services). The amount of money we have is the amount of products and services we have not the amount of notes we have.

            Why the comparison between health and money seems difficult is because we think the notes and 0's are money which is a major misperception. They are just potential money until exchanged for something.

          5. Hahaha- WAIT A MINUTE!!

            Ok, if you kidnap me and take my heart, then I would DEFINITELY say that I have less health because YOU have been greedy and taken it! LOL!! That's my point!

            ALL I've been saying this whole time is that You CAN take someone's money, leave them with less, and then be called greedy, say "That's too much".

            Randy said you wouldn't say that about health.

            However, YOU have found the time when someone could- if they steal your heart!

            So, I am saying that YES- someone would call stealing another's heart as greedy!

            Got me?

          6. Your question was
            "why would you equate money and health…."

            The new example I gave was based on the idea of Corruption and Stealing. You said that

            "someone cannot take someone else's health but you can take someone else's money"

            It was an example to show that it could be done the same way with health as in money.

            I can take your health and decrease it to improve my health. As I could take your money and decrease it to improve my own wealth. But people only talk about these things when it relates to money.

            If we are talking about about fair exchange in a Capitalist economy then you can diminish 8 of my fish but I will have gained 2 of your chickens which I value more. So by trading with me you have increased my wealth and increased yours because we both get something we value more than what we already had.

            So to increase my wealth I have increased your wealth, otherwise you wouldn't trade with me. In our current economy instead of diminishing your chickens I have diminished your notes/IOUs (potential money) that represent your chickens (real money). But now you have fish instead so you are better off, not worse off, by giving me your money. You could even now create notes to represent the fish. So for me to get more than I have, I need to give you more than you have.

            So Randy, I assume, was making the point that people will not look at someone with perfect health and say that is too much health but they would say that is too much wealth. In reality they are the same which was the point of the post.

            Health can be stolen and wealth can be stolen so the comparison needs to be the same with both. If we won't say it about health then we shouldn't say it about wealth.

            I hope this now makes sense as to how Randy was able to equate money with health.

      2. Have you ever giving blood Bones? If so you were giving health, ever giving plasma, bone marrow?

        You are giving health to someone who needs those things and those things have a very high perceived value to someone. They had to spend money to get those things that you donated at your local Red Cross or hospital.

        Also those organizations require money to operate to get that healthy blood etc. to the needy recipients. So you do give health.

        Great health can't be achieved in today's world with out an abundance of money.

        A great example would be 3rd world countries who need medical supplies and food. That's why you see so many organizations and individuals give, so those countries can have better health too. Because there is abundance here.

        And getting back to perceived value. I've learned over the years in buying RE that something is only worth what someone is willing to pay for it and you agree to sell it at that price. Sentimental value and what the market value calls for are different. You can say it's worth blah, blah, but will the buyer say it's worth it to them. Only if you can prove that it would be worth that to them.

        When you made your commercial Bones you/they agreed to a value to which you would be compensated right?

        Health is the same way, how much is good health worth to you? What would you spend to get or keep better health?

        1. Hm... donating blood. Interesting way to look at "giving health". It's true, when I donate blood (or platelets- which HURTS!), I am giving someone else better health. Truth is, I am temporarily less healthy, but I get it back through my own habits.

          We could look at healthy blood as being from my own habits, and a wealthy wallet being from my own habits, right?

          Except that my blood does not come from other people.

          I don't think this is really part of this conversation, but it's a great way to look at it.

          1. Actually you aren't temporarily less healthy when you give blood. It's actually the only way to lower your iron stores, which is one of the big reasons for oxidizing in the body and recommendations of antioxidants.

            This is why it is recommended you (and post menopausal women) don't take supplements with iron.

            Therefore, by giving someone else health, you are actually receive immediate health benefits in return.

  11. The Cure - It's Never Enough 🙂
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N5enlLwo94M

    However much I push it down
    It's never enough
    However much I push it around
    It's never enough
    However much I make it out
    It's never enough
    Never enough
    However much I do

    However big I ever feel
    It's never enough
    Whatever I do to make it real
    It's never enough
    In any way I try to speak
    It's never enough
    Never enough
    However much I try to speak
    It's never enough

    However much I'm falling down
    It's never enough
    However much I'm falling out
    It's never enough
    Whatever smile I smile the most
    It's never enough
    Never enough
    However I smile
    I smile the most

    So let me hold it up
    Just one more go
    Holding it up for just once more
    One more time to fill it up
    One more time to kill
    But whatever I do
    It's never enough
    It's never enough

    It's never enough

  12. Hi mr Randy G.Xubava tema,kakto vinagi,vie ste dobar trenior.Mislia ,che zdraveto i parite sa svarzani.Zdraveto e v osnovata na stastie ,obich,lubov...Parite iskat risk,naxodchivost,darzost,a tova saotvetstva samo pri zdravi xora,no ne izkluchvam i kasmeta.Niakoi kazvat niama kasmet,ima mnogo trud.Ama poniakoga mnogo se trudish i nisto ne se poluchava.Kakvo mislite za roliata na kasmeta.Kakvo e kasmet-dobro mislene ili....no sam sigyrna che v vsichko stoi zdraveto...

  13. I guess this also leads to the question:

    "Is greed for anything, good or bad?"

    Lets start with looking it up in the dictionary:

    Greed: intense and selfish desire for something, esp. wealth, power or food

    What's bad about that? Nothing i'd say. Isn't it great to have 'intense desires'? Not to me. I like them... they make me feel alive.

    "But what about 'selfish'?", some people will probably say. "Isn't that bad?"

    Seems that the word "selfish" (again) plays a major role here (this great blog/world). Lets look that up:

    Selfish: concerned above all with one's own profit or pleasure.

    I hope everybody agrees that 'Being concerned about one's profit and pleasure' is a great thing. (Except when you believe the "profit is bad" or "pleasure is for the devil" meme. Who put these in our collective brains? Maybe some (selfish?) institution that wanted it (profit and pleasure) all for themselfs for centuries? )

    So what about the "above all" part? Imho 'Above all' doesnt exclude something. It just tells what comes 'first'. And here we are back again to Ayn Rand's philosophy.
    And Jesus' philosophy too? "love your neighbour like you love yourself"? Doesnt that also mean that you first have to love yourself, before you can love others? So 'above all', you have to love yourself.

    It kinda all revolves around the meaning you give to (and how you feel about) a few words and concepts: selfish, profit, pleasure, above all... and money of course. But arent those meanings meme's in itself too? Have we ever questioned our meanings/feelings of words? I think we should. Accepting that the same word can mean different things to other people can prevent some fights and wars.

    Lets all get 'brainwashed' from those infectious mind meme's and start communicating with feelings!

    I just realised that I didnt address the "Is having a desire for money different from having a desire for love, health...?"-question yet.

    Anyway... these were my thoughts about greed 😉

    What is money? Money is used to exchange value. Money is perceived value. The dictionary about 'Value:' the importance or preciousness of something. So a rich person would have more 'value' than a poor one. That would make him or her more important or precious? Off course not. So its clearly our perception of value and the 'value' of money that can create an issue.

    Here is the imbalance that leads to much confusion: Someone is not a more 'valuable' person because he or she has more money. If you feel /think that a person with more money than you is more 'valuable' than you, it is logical you resent (and fight) that. This is a dangerous meme. We all are created equal, so we all have the same 'value'. I think too much 'value' is being given to money. Nothing has more value. All is equal: energy in an infinite field. Its all about experience and perception. Value is just a tag, but given too much emphasis can create imbalance in people and societies.

    It's all made up of the same energy that is all around us.

    Hey... am I ranting here?! 🙂

    Guess the big question is: why are we here? next post? 😉

    Eric from The Netherlands

  14. When my friend pays $400k cash for an AMG Benz, I know people are asking: "Does he really need a car that expensive?". The answer of course is no, he doesn't NEED it. My only question is: "When are we going for a spin?". Randy's point is so clear and succinct, a perfect analogy, yet people have allowed themselves to self-limit and make excuses as to why we're not supposed to be prosperous. Which is exactly why they aren't. Thanks Randy for the insight and clarity, once again.

    Greg

  15. Great post/thought Randy,
    It seems like to me that some are either to focused on arguing for the sake of arguing or caught up in the symantics of money vs. wealth, really we need to make a distinction between the two? Would it have been any different if it had been phrased- Can you ever have to much wealth?
    As to the "percieved value" point of view I know this to be another false distinction, the land+building being worth more is not percieved value it is real value. Why? Because of two things
    1- Some one is willing to pay more for the developed land than the cost of the land plus the cost of the materials to build therefore it is not perceived value it is true value. The buyer says "Yep that's what it is worth" not well I perceive it to have this or that value.
    2- The cost is not simply a matter of x+y=z, rather x+y+(knowledge to make it work+labor+time+++)=Z- Doubt wealth grows from nearly nothing? Think silca sand circa 1947 vs. that same sand used in a microchip today. It's perceived value did not change. It is its true value that changed.

    1. If it is true value and not perceived value then why does it change in a Boom or a recession?. If it was true value then surely it would never change?

      If someone builds 10 more hotels next door and they all go up for sale at the same time the buyers will perceive them all to be worth less and will make an offer dependent on their perception of what it is worth to them. The first hotel is the same but the price will be reduced.

      To know somethings value it always has to be compared to something else. Even a fake story in the local news about toxic waste on the site could drop the price.

        1. Thanks for the discussion Bones. It is fun to think about and clarify all of these points. You bring up very important questions that make understanding money much easier.
          I wasn't as clear in my own head about all this till you brought up the questions.
          Nothing beats a good, fun debate when we are all looking for better solutions. Especially when the subject is money 🙂

          1. I agree- I'm here to learn, so when something doesn't feel right to me, I want to clarify and ask, question, and re-ask until it does.

            I think I'm seen as argumentative (maybe I am), but it's from a sincere desire to learn.

            "If two people agree on everything, one of them isn't necessary"

            Well, that goes for an entire forum too!

    2. Russ- I agree with you- using the term wealth might be better- it's not semantics at all; it's really being clear with our communication, and I'm not arguing- I am asking how they are the same.

      1- You say "someone", but there may be no one, and then it is valueless. If no one values that developed land, then it's worth ZERO. There's no such thing as inherent value (expect for maybe people)

      2- No- a microchip is USELESS unless someone wants it. Ask someone in the middle of that same desert whether or not they'd rather have a the newest microchip or a glass of clean water- you'll see perceived value instantly.

  16. Juicy topic Randy! It sure does get a response from people. And W David C - fantastic comments! People infected with the meme about hogging money lose and squander their wealth courtesy of the law of attraction, which draws two types of people together - one that doesn't believe they deserve the money that they have and another one that believes that they deserve MORE than they have. If we generate wealth by the ideas in our mind and other people create wealth by the ideas in their minds, we cannot possibly be taking the wealth of others away when we attract and accumulate more for ourselves.

  17. @Bones The labor of love starts from within. When you are passionate about doing something you give your work your life energy. Its like a farmer sowing a seed. He is just not throwing it. There is an expectation within for the crop to grow and produce fruit. And this expectation within him motivates him to take care of the crop at all stages of growth. Money is not a paper that is printed and kept outside for you to go and grab it. It is something that you bring forth to yourself through the passion within you. 🙂

    1. We are not talking about labors of love, we are not talking about passion- we are talking about whether or not money and health are the same thing.

      I understand that IN THEORY, you do something with love and passion, it creates something great, and then the world is better off, and then IF you get around to charging for it for some reason, THEN you make money- I get that.

      If you never charge for it, you never make a dime, even though you may love it and the world is better off, and you have increased the "wealth" of the world- if you don't say "You now owe me", you never make a dime.

      1. Brother Bones, I appreciate your sincerity, your vitality and passion for life. Might be you are looking for a change of pace and place. Travel or getaway will be a good idea. Fill yourself up to fullness so you can overflow.

  18. and the passions and motivation can give us energy that needs for health building. I would like to say I just remember the pain of poverty when I cannot afford to buy vitamins and foods, it sucks!. I don't really want it anyway. When I have money for myself, and give a tremendous amount of effort to create paintings, do better in a job, not supplying my mind of infectious negative meme about money, from within, my health recovered. after a year, my mother said to me, you are looking healthy..

  19. Wow! Randy, I know that you want us to be critique thinkers and all that... but this time I do not have nothing but to agree and smile for the great and simple way you put something like this!!!

    I love it... We recognize the "success" of someone who achieve good health, but blame someone who achieve wealth.

    Thank you.

  20. Hi Randy,

    Very good point. I never looked at this idea in this way before. I do know people who are in poor health who are jealous of others in good health and wonder what they've done to deserve their situation. But they certainly don't think that the healthy individual is being greedy.

    I just started your Midas Mentality program and have read the Prosperity Series. I am discovering lots of new ways of thinking. I also discovered a victim (damsel in distress) mindset that I was completely unaware of previously.

    Thanks for sharing!

    Ellen

  21. Ok, money is an exchange tool for something you value. Let's say for energy. And energy is becoming in short supply isn't it? Wrong, it isn't. Just the way we think about it. Did you know that to equal the energy consumption to the amount of energy the sun dumps on our little blue happy lump of matter we have to use per person the equivalent of 1.5 small scale nuclear plants? And that is just on our planet. The vast majority of the energy the sun generates (generates?! What happened to E=MC2) dispersed into space. And how many other planets do the same? So there is NO shortage of energy at all, just a problem with our thinking about it. So maybe the value of energy (and thus the money we pay for it) is zilch since it is in such abundant supply. Hey, what about our thoughts?! Aren't they a form of energy? So yes, it is all in our minds and our minds are capable of anything.
    Unfortunately, our minds are trained in scarcity thinking. And thus, we think that earning a lot is taking away from others when there is absolutely no need for that.

  22. There are a finite amount of resources on planet Earth.

    The world population is heading towards 9 billion.

    If one hoards more of the Earth's finite resources than he needs, others' needs are left unfulfilled.

    Only those with 'more than enough' wealth are able to hoard more finite resources than they need.

    In a dog-eat-dog world, where hoarding more finite resources than you need is considered 'success,' you end up with a world of a few fat dogs, and lots and lots of dead and wounded dogs.

    Our Joe from above is unable to hoard his health, or love - those are already his and his alone. However, if Joe hoarded more 'health credits' and 'love credits' than he needed, thereby depriving his neighbors of health and love, I think his neighbors would be pretty damn pissed off at Joe...

  23. Money talks .

    We can do lots of lovely things with money that can't be done without it, I think some people are against it because they need to make changes in themselves in order to attract money and it's kind of scary for them.

    I love the way you do these kind of challenging thinking.

    Good luck

  24. Just last night my husband and I were at the store. As we were getting our items scanned we were chatting with the clerk and somehow we got to singing a little of "I want to be a billionaire"... the clerk laughed with us and said, "Yeah, right! But with lots of money comes lots of problems!" She obviously decided that we'd agree with that and somehow that would make it alright to continue living a lack oriented life. We countered with, "with a lot of money, you pay people to deal with many of the "perceived" problems. You jet off somewhere and enjoy your life. You drive the car of your dreams. You live in the house that you love and you have more then enough to deal with anything that comes your way."

    It was so obvious that thoughts like this had never occurred to the young lady. At one time in our lives, they hadn't occurred to us either.

    So glad we attracted mentors like Randy and many others into our lives to help us let go of these societal mind viruses!!!

    Tiffany

  25. Frank, how many Boeing 747's where there on planet earth when dinosaurs roamed the earth?

    If you you answered "zero", well, where did they came from then?

    All the materials have already been around us for ever. Mankind just needed the cumulative ideas of making steel and alloys, electricity, plastics, etc. And of course the meme 'man cannot fly' had to be shattered by the Wright brothers.

    Also, 300 years ago, the elite's standards of living was lower than John Doe who lives on well fare today. Think a house with windows, electricity, phone, internet. Think health care and community services like police, fire department, public transportation etc.

    We've been able to raise standards of living for everybody. It's and-and, not either-or:

    Let's say I have fruit trees and vegetables in my garden and have more than I need for myself. And let's say you a great teacher and are free in the weekends.
    Now we can trade: I provide your family fresh fruits and vegetables, and in exchange you tutor my kids in the weekends.

    My guess is that you consider fruit, vegetables and tutors to be finite. But in my example, both our livestyles go up, without depleting any resource.

    By saying "If one hoards more of the Earth’s finite resources than he needs, others’ needs are left unfulfilled.", you imply that there is EXACTLY enough for everybody.
    If I "hoard" 100 cans of tuna - in stead of just the two I'm going to eat for dinner, how do you know someone is dying of hunger?
    If I "hoard" 25 suits - in stead of just 1, how do you know someone else is walking the streets naked?
    If I have two cars, one for the family and one sports car for fun, how do you know some is car-less?

    - Robert

    1. Wow I've missed a lot here! Isn't the whole point of studying prosperity that we are learning to create our own reality?

      I'm choosing to create the reality where there is unlimited money, health and good stuff for everyone. If you focus on the limitation it will show up for you. That's more or less what I've learned and I'm finding it to be true for me!

  26. To question whether health, love, money, happiness, or anything for that matter, is finite is in my opinion a way to express a frustration that lies within. The ability or need to question it is the human mind getting in the way. In other words, stop worrying about it and the balance will find itself without you getting in the way.

  27. I am not yet wealthy, I took the" work hard, get a good education, get a good job" pill and have some work to do to dig out of the student debt hole, but here's my perception with wealth.

    Paper assets are paper assets, they decrease in value as they're printed, but wealthy people buy things with inherent value. They trade it in for land, property and commodities of inherent value, and they spend the paper assets on things they enjoy in the moment (the cars, the fine restaurants, they skybox seats, etc), this makes sense to spend because the spending power is always decreasing when not invested elsewhere in wealth building assets. Most people earn a dollar, spend $1.25, and lean on others to make up the difference when their bill finally comes due.

    Now you can take the lottery ticket approach and make your money vanish, or you can take a different approach. Many wealthy families have vast art collections or antique collections, they'll hold a % in metals, some invest in fine wines or classic cars. They also hold value in equities/brands/stocks that then create more income for them. Their paper assets have now turned into longlasting value in the equity they create and the credit opportunities they create (home equity lines of credit, etc) which then can be used to fund and leverage further sources of income and equity or add to everyday enjoyment of your life.

  28. Money is infinite. Health is infinite. Energy is infinite. The universe is infinite. Love is infinite. Ideas are infinite.

    It is never too much. Prosperity is infinite.

    Thanks for a very thought provoking post.

  29. All these B.S. (belief system) I am reading may come from one meme - The Law Of Scarcity we were taught in economics. For the past four hundred years, virtually all practitioners of the dismal science we call economics have agreed on one basic premise: namely that a society's wealth is determined by its supply of physical resources--its land, labor, minerals, water, and so on. And underlying this premise has been another, even more profound, assumption--one supposedly so obvious that it is rarely mentioned: namely, that the entire world contains a limited amount of these physical resources.

    This means, from an economic point of view, that life is what the mathematicians call a zero-sum game. After all, if there are only limited resources, one person's gain must be another person's loss; the richer one person is, the poorer his neighbors must be. Over the centuries, this view of the world has been responsible for innumerable wars, revolutions, political movements, government policies, business strategies, and possibly a religion or two.

    We do not live in a resource-scarce environment. That may seem hard to believe, but the businessperson and the politician--as well as the butcher, the baker, and the candlestick maker--who
    continue to behave as if they were operating in the old zero-sum world will soon find themselves eclipsed by those who recognize the new realities and react accordingly.

    In the alchemic world in which we now live, a society's wealth is still a function of its physical resources, as traditional economics has long maintained. But unlike the outdated economist, the alchemist of today recognizes that technology controls both the definition and the supply of physical resources. In fact, for the past few decades, it has been the backlog of unimplemented technological advances, rather than unused physical resources, that has been the determinant of real growth.

  30. Rodriguez,I think you think you are too smart for anything or anyone. But do you know that God says, you can have everything, in abundance, whether it's health or money. Everything, is EVERYTHING. You know why? So you can bless others.
    If you are poor, broke, sick or lacking, how are you supposed to bless others? You can't! You gotta take care of yourself first and that starts by inviting God into your life, accepting Christ as your number one. Then, asking God what HIS will is for your life. I tell you this though, God will bless you, so you can bless others.
    Having money & wealth can be used as a tool to help others.

  31. "I will engage in no transaction which does not benefit all whom it affects"

    As long as you keep that oath then keep the money coming....You are only doing good by making it!!!!

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  • 96 comments on “How Much is Too Much?”

    1. Well I know my church and the M.O.R.E. project wishes I had more.

      I really don't think you can have too much. What's worse to much in the wrong hands or to little in the wrong hands?

      It's what you do with what you got that matters and that is a personal thing.

      Vincent

    2. ....Because money comes FROM other people, and health does not.

      I've heard you make this comparison before, and it never made sense to me- I'm not being confrontational- I'd like you to help me understand how they are comparable.

      I understand that you believe money is inexhaustible, like kisses or health, but that just doesn't quite square with reality.

      Money is something you get from other people, and health is not- that's where I see the difference, and that's the answer I see to your question.

      1. At one time there was no money! Now there is many, many, many Trillions in the world. It is all created. The more someone creates the more there is for everyone else. If I have a piece of land that is worth £10,000 and build a hotel on it. I use material that costs £100,000 but the hotel and land combined is worth £500,000. So I have just created a £390,000 increase in my net worth that didn't come from anyone else.

        1. I learned the value of land a long time ago. Especially when a building goes on it afterwards. There will always be a market for land. But good luck finding a piece of land in the UK for only 10000 Pounds.

        2. W David C - I your posts about value and wealth and they were right on the money. A great explanation of percieved value et al. You would have made a great eceonomics professor.

      2. I think David explained this pretty good. The other thing to keep in mind is that when money comes FROM other people, it's because they chose to spend it with you. They want the value you offer. And all prosperity is a value for value exchange.

        Now they can choose their value foolishly (buying lottery tickets for example) or prudently. But it is always their choice.

        -RG

        1. Randy, I believe we have money mixed up with paper wealth and (perceived) value.

          David added 390,000 of perceived value. It only becomes money, when a buyer takes coins and bank notes from his wallet, and transfers it to David. Which leaves the money supply unchanged.

          Money (as in coins and bank notes) is finite, unless you print more. You can't create it without devaluing it. Just ask Ben Bernanke. What you can create out of thin air though, is paper wealth and/or value.

          Did the creation of Facebook create $15 billion in tangible money? Or is it just paper wealth untill already existing money changes hands?

          Or do you see flaws in this reasoning?

          Cheers, Robert

          1. Money is simply a meme created by man. Of course governments printing more every time they overspend devalues it. But in the real economy, the value is determined by what people are willing to trade it for.

            -RG

            1. OK, and how does that make money infinite?

              I get the concept of infinite ideas which create value, but infinite money?

              Robert

          2. By building the hotel I added value that wasn't there before. I can refinance the hotel and take out £300,000 cash and circulate it into the economy and then the people I spend it with will have enhanced the the quality of my life with their products and service. Then they can use it get value from other peoples products and services.

            Many Billions are being printed every day, which causes inflation, an incremental decrease in the value of each note. But everyone is better off because if the land was a waste ground that was nasty looking has been turned into something beautiful it also adds value to all the properties in the area and everyone wins.

            All money was printed to represent perceived value. That is why more and more is made because we are all adding value with every product and service that we produce. So with every passing year the quality of all our lives are improved.

            Money is just an idea and always based on perceived value. Currency was initially used to represent the value of Gold held in a Bank, but since that was removed it is just based on the trust that the economy of the country can pay it all back. (as cash is just IOU's)

            Wealth is all about the speed at which money circulates in the economy so we can use it to produce value!

            1. If you get a loan from the bank, because the bank perceives your hotel to be sufficient collateral, how does that make money infinite?

              Sure, you created value on paper, on which you haven taken out a loan. Like a home equity loan.

              How does getting a loan make money infinite?

              - Robert

      3. That sounds to me like you are coming from a position of scarcity, that if you acquire more it means that someone else can't have that money. There is truly no scarcity, there is abundance in everything, including money.

      4. At it's essence. moeny is an idea, as is good health and happiness. And ideas leave not there source. Also, keep in mind that more money has been printed and circulated in the last 36 months than in all the previous years combined. And more is printed every day. There's plenty for everyone, completely dependent on one's consciousness.

        1. Wow! I love that this convo got going- But yes, we are talking about the difference between MONEY (Which is represented with dollars and coins) and VALUE (which is arbitrary, and completely subjective).

          I understand they you can always add perceived VALUE to something, and people can choose to use their money to acquire that value you have created.

          However, that means that MONEY only comes FROM someone else, and that they are not buying actual value, but ALWAYS perceived value.

          When you set a price on something, it has nothing to do with the actual value. Money is supposed to be the exchange medium between products and services that a buyer PERCEIVES will help him, but it is not that at all anymore.

          Now it's some kind of "score" we keep in theory based on what "value" you've given society- but it is not that in experience or practice.

          So after all of that, making the difference between value and money- HOW is it that Money is equal to health?

          It seems like VALUE might be more like Health? Is that more along the line? Someone wouldn't say "Gosh, he provides so much value!" as a negative...

          1. Reply to Robert and Bones

            Money is actually anything that can be traded (cows, chickens, cars, bricks, knowledge, skills etc) that is why it is infinite. What we now call money is just currency. Currency (notes and 0's in a bank account) is just IOU's based on perceived value. It is written on them 'I promise to pay the bearer on demand' because it was originally backed by gold. So you could use the note to pick up your gold anytime you want and this saved us carrying it and preventing theft. Now it is just an IOU based on trust that the value will stay the same. The amount of IOU's that can be written is infinite.

            It is not and never has been based on actual value, because such a thing does not exist. In a boom it appears that there is more money going around because people perceive everything to be worth more and has trust that more will come around. Almost everyone with property has a rise in their net worth even tho nothing has changed.

            In a recession it appears that there is less going around because everyone perceives everything to be worth less, they get scared and stop circulating it as quickly. Almost everyone with property has a decrease in there net worth even tho nothing has changed. It is based on trust, oversupply, undersupply and fear of lack

            If we all sit in a room and write IOU's for each other based on what we think each other is worth it will not be dependent on any real value but just the perceived value of each person. Knowledge, skills and ideas are infinite so the IOU's that can be printed to represent these is infinite.

            The amount of wealth we have depends on how much perceived value we can create. Not on any real value because real value would have to be compared to something, but nothing has a fixed value. It is always changing.

            1. David - that's an amazing perspective on the topic of value. Quite a paradigm shift too, needs some digesting but it resonates! Thanks for sharing!

      5. I agree with you Rodriguez, there is only a set amount of money printed, it is finite, if few people have lots, than many people have little, this is an imbalance in society.

        All the "interest" on money that is owing in the world, does not physically exist, therefore for you to "get ahead" and pay out the interest owing on your house for example, this is leaving a shortfall in the money pit, it is impossible for the world to pay all debt, the money just does not exist.

        If we all lived a simpler life without greed perhaps they may intime become a balance in the world, without extremes of wealth and poverty. Idealistic, yes, but it starts with each one of us.

    3. I enjoy meeting people who have great health, lots of love and are happy people. I do run into people who believe healthy people are lucky or they are unlucky because they are sick. I have met people who are envious of others love. I know that some people who are divorced do not like to socialize with my wife an I becuase we are in love and happily married. Great though provoking post Randy.

      Thanks,

      Paul

    4. For me, it's the choices we make and the thoughts we think.

      If we CHOOSE to think those type of thoughts, we need to be accountable for the outcome. As far as I'm concerned, there's no limit to the amount of money, health or anything else available to us, so why make such a statement?

    5. Why do wee say it about money? Who knows. It could be jelousy. It could be conditioning. By conditioning we have many conflicted ideas about money. You have most people - when they are a young age - being told by religion to abandon material things and how wonderful it would be to walk around in sandals. You also have the media portraying wealthy people as bastards. You're never taught or instructed about the practicality or how to handle money. Most of us have never been taught how think and go in business for ourselves. We've been conditioned to work for others - school does a good job of that.

    6. There are so many bizarre, weird and silly ideas about money. Your example is perfect.

      When your fortune is attracted in harmony with universal forces there is no such thing as too much.

      Ryan Biddulph

    7. In essence, no one really forced you to buy anything!

      As well as you can be prosperous and wealthy whatever you do,

      it is not necessarily about how much you make,

      but how much you keep when everything is paid,

      and what you do with that money.

      10 000 dollars is really 2.4 million dollars over 30 years with annual 20% increase. That's how Warren Buffet looks at 10 000 dollars.

      Generally, people who have abandonment issues have the same with money and material things.

      Again, it is vital to RELEASE issues, and there are various techniques for that. Visualize!

      We have all heard about "emptying the cup" if it's already full. That's what release means.

      And the more you do out of love and respect, the more you will have with which to work. This is Universal Law!

      1. Just curious...what makes you think one has to keep it? Holding onto money comes from the limiting belief that the flow will or could stop. Oxygen is the most precious commodity. Are you holding onto your breath, saving for later? What if you had a cosmic overdraft protection account where all that you needed always showed up, for the rest of your life? Consciousness, through Spirit, is our Source for everything, including money.

          1. The size of our savings determine the size of our opportunities. If we have 0 in savings and someone offers us a job at £100 per day we will be excited about it. If we have £1000 in savings and we are offered a job at £100 per day (10% of our money) we will be feeling OK about it. If we have £10,000 in savings and we are offered £100 per day we will have less motivation to do it. If we have £100,000 in saving then the motivation to add 0.01% will be very small. If we have £1,000,000 in savings then to add 0.001% will be very, very small.

            So if we have a large amount our minds will create bigger opportunities to create the same level of motivation in the first example. £1,000,000 in savings will lead to £1,000,000 opportunities.

    8. Randy...I get that you are fighting the "memes" out there that say that all rich people are greedy. That's a worthy fight. But I think it's not intellectually sound to seriously equate it to having optimal health or love. You can't be greedy with personal health or devotion. Over the ages, riches have quite often come at the expense of others. We are now in a new age (I believe) where an exchange of value for money has created a relationship to wealth or prosperity that is different from the past. But greed is the pursuit of riches has not died out. Millions ARE oppressed by others pursuing greed...which I define as money-generating actions that harm, take advantage of, or hoodwink others. The financial markets have had many of these. I abhor victim-hood and support your efforts wholeheartedly for people to stand up and take responsibility for their decisions. Having said that...I don't think we can claim that greed is good or that greed has gone away as a factor in society.

        1. I think there are some serious lack and limiting beliefs being expressed here and a definite energy to repel money. Please think about that and I will pick up here on another post.

          -RG

          1. That's why I asked; I keep hearing things that just don't equate with what I perceive as reality, so I'd like to see the other side of the curtain.

            So- "Money is found in other people's pockets" (Dan Kennedy), but Health is not- so I am looking for in what ways you see it differently.

            1. This is EXACTLY the kind of song you would write with your beliefs about money. No wonder you like it! We have a lot of work to do on the next post...

              -RG

      1. Greed is not the same as wanting a lot of wealth. Greed is wanting a lot of wealth and not being willing to give fair value in exchange for it. If you have an infinite amount of fair value to trade, then wealth is infinite. If you are limited in what you have to offer, then your potential for wealth is limited. I believe that limitation is set by you. There are VERY FEW people who are incapable of finding a way to increase what they have to offer. there are a LOT of people unwilling to put the effort into doing so.

        1. KH, I agree. I love the way Nancy said it.

          And to tie in my understanding from what David said earlier about all value being perceived value since there is no such thing as real value as things are always changing - it would equate then, if you take that premise to be true, that money is indeed infinite because it is dependent on the amount of perceived value we are willing to give in return.

          And since we are fully creative beings, our inherent value is thus infinite, so we will always have unlimited value to exchange for more of whatever we want.

          The question then would be, how relevant & pervasive is the perceived value you are offering now in context to today's world? Because if we follow this line of thinking, how can it be too much? There is no basis for comparison & to validate that. It is already infinite.

          Amazing content in this post. Thanks guys.

    9. People can be say that about money because money is tangible. You can’t physically hold health or love or happiness.

      There are no fine lines with money. Either you have it or you don’t. On the other hand, you can have different degrees of health and happiness.

      While there may be differing levels of what people believe it means to be successful, rich, or wealthy, money is something that most people having trouble being content with because they know that there is physically more out there for them to have and get. Since there is always more and since it is a tangible experience, it is easy to compare with others, which creates more desire. Health and happiness cannot be physically comparable because they are not cut and dry experiences and objects like money.

    10. As Bob Proctor would say "When the source is infinite no one can take more than their share". The source is infinite. Whoever understands it gets whatever they want and they are fair enough to tell everyone that the source is infinite. Those who don't understand it doesn't care to receive whats on offer.

        1. Look at what needs to be done. Shouldn't hold back from direct experience. Set your total concentration at the task at hand. Be practical and innovative. Test and refine your ideas of the value that you want to deliver. You deliver value when you do something with a lot of passion. It's something that starts from within.

          1. A painting is a perfect example of infinite wealth. The Mona Lisa was once a blank canvass and a vision. Now it is probably worth hundreds of millions. All based on perceived value. It is still just a canvass with some paint but because so many value the painting it could be traded for almost anything.

            Wealth is just perceived value of what we have to trade. So it is infinite and can not stop anyone else from having what they want. Because they can create something with an idea that can be worth huge wealth.

            1. Um..... the question is not "Is wealth infinite?"- that's what you are answering, but- no one asked that.

              The question is why would you equate money and health....

              Someone CANNOT take someone's health.
              You CAN take someone's money.

              Every time you increase your own money supply (printing money excluded), it is taking from someone else's.

              That's what it is designed to do.

              Yes, I buy a book, and I give $10 for that- I understand that I perceive that I have traded fairly perceived value for perceived value, but my MONEY is decreased.

              So- the painting has increased the VALUE of the canvas, and has increased the enjoyment of it for people everywhere, but it has NOT increased the money for it- it is TRADED for something else.

            2. Bones,

              Robert asked how does getting a loan make money infinite? So I was answering that.

              If by taking money from another you are talking about stealing or corruption then it can be equated to health very easily. I could poison you or cut your leg off and therefore take your health. Same as I could steal your money.

              If you are talking about fair, unforced exchange then your money/ wealth has not decreased only your IOU's/ currency. But you actually have more money (money is actually anything that can be traded, not the notes) because you have traded something you value less for something you value more. At that point you valued the $10 less than you valued the Book. So your wealth has been increased by doing the trade.

              It is like you traded with me 2 of your chickens for 8 of my fish. You would only trade the chickens if you felt you were better off with the fish than with the chickens. It is just that instead of carrying around the chickens you carry around a note that represents the chickens in a safe location. That note tells me I can pick up the chickens anytime I want or else trade the IOU for something else at a market (e,g a coat). Then the person I give your IOU to can go and get the chickens whenever he wants or trade it for something else.

              Currency which we get confused with money is an IOU that has 'I promise to pay the bearer on demand' written on it. That means you promise to pay me with your chickens when I hand in the IOU at a later date. Wealth is the stuff we have that can be traded. The IOUs are only worth what the person thinks the stuff you have is worth. All perceived value.

              Paper currency was just created to make trade easier but has no value in and of itself. It is just worthless paper unless it is backed by something. So the more we have to back up the value the more IOUs we will have to trade.

              So we create our own health and in the same way we can create our own tradable products and services. Health and wealth come from ideas and action not from taking from others.

            3. No- if you poison me, it decreases my health, but does NOT increase yours as a result.

              No- In the fish and chicken example, the trade is supposed to be EQUAL- just as I am valuing one more than the other, so are you- the trade is EQUAL That is what money is for- an EXCHANGE.

              Yes, I understand that currency and money are just ideas and pieces of paper that represent IOUs.

            4. Good point Bones,

              So a better example regarding health would be that I kidnap you and steal your heart to transplant it into my body because yours is healthier.

              In the trading the chickens and fish example of course I would not trade with you if I did not feel that I was better off with your chickens than my fish. We both have to feel we win or we would not trade.

              Also on the inflation point you made earlier, printing more money decreasing the value of all money is the same as saying that every time your chickens lay an egg and more chickens grow it devalues all other chickens. Supply and demand.
              But the number of available chickens will have increased so all buyers of chickens are better off.

              Randy Wrote
              You’d never say that about health. Or love. Or happiness. So why would you say it about money?

              He didn't say 'So why would you say that about currency/ IOU's'
              Currency/ notes are only potential money until converted into real money (products and services). The amount of money we have is the amount of products and services we have not the amount of notes we have.

              Why the comparison between health and money seems difficult is because we think the notes and 0's are money which is a major misperception. They are just potential money until exchanged for something.

            5. Hahaha- WAIT A MINUTE!!

              Ok, if you kidnap me and take my heart, then I would DEFINITELY say that I have less health because YOU have been greedy and taken it! LOL!! That's my point!

              ALL I've been saying this whole time is that You CAN take someone's money, leave them with less, and then be called greedy, say "That's too much".

              Randy said you wouldn't say that about health.

              However, YOU have found the time when someone could- if they steal your heart!

              So, I am saying that YES- someone would call stealing another's heart as greedy!

              Got me?

            6. Your question was
              "why would you equate money and health…."

              The new example I gave was based on the idea of Corruption and Stealing. You said that

              "someone cannot take someone else's health but you can take someone else's money"

              It was an example to show that it could be done the same way with health as in money.

              I can take your health and decrease it to improve my health. As I could take your money and decrease it to improve my own wealth. But people only talk about these things when it relates to money.

              If we are talking about about fair exchange in a Capitalist economy then you can diminish 8 of my fish but I will have gained 2 of your chickens which I value more. So by trading with me you have increased my wealth and increased yours because we both get something we value more than what we already had.

              So to increase my wealth I have increased your wealth, otherwise you wouldn't trade with me. In our current economy instead of diminishing your chickens I have diminished your notes/IOUs (potential money) that represent your chickens (real money). But now you have fish instead so you are better off, not worse off, by giving me your money. You could even now create notes to represent the fish. So for me to get more than I have, I need to give you more than you have.

              So Randy, I assume, was making the point that people will not look at someone with perfect health and say that is too much health but they would say that is too much wealth. In reality they are the same which was the point of the post.

              Health can be stolen and wealth can be stolen so the comparison needs to be the same with both. If we won't say it about health then we shouldn't say it about wealth.

              I hope this now makes sense as to how Randy was able to equate money with health.

        2. Have you ever giving blood Bones? If so you were giving health, ever giving plasma, bone marrow?

          You are giving health to someone who needs those things and those things have a very high perceived value to someone. They had to spend money to get those things that you donated at your local Red Cross or hospital.

          Also those organizations require money to operate to get that healthy blood etc. to the needy recipients. So you do give health.

          Great health can't be achieved in today's world with out an abundance of money.

          A great example would be 3rd world countries who need medical supplies and food. That's why you see so many organizations and individuals give, so those countries can have better health too. Because there is abundance here.

          And getting back to perceived value. I've learned over the years in buying RE that something is only worth what someone is willing to pay for it and you agree to sell it at that price. Sentimental value and what the market value calls for are different. You can say it's worth blah, blah, but will the buyer say it's worth it to them. Only if you can prove that it would be worth that to them.

          When you made your commercial Bones you/they agreed to a value to which you would be compensated right?

          Health is the same way, how much is good health worth to you? What would you spend to get or keep better health?

          1. Hm... donating blood. Interesting way to look at "giving health". It's true, when I donate blood (or platelets- which HURTS!), I am giving someone else better health. Truth is, I am temporarily less healthy, but I get it back through my own habits.

            We could look at healthy blood as being from my own habits, and a wealthy wallet being from my own habits, right?

            Except that my blood does not come from other people.

            I don't think this is really part of this conversation, but it's a great way to look at it.

            1. Actually you aren't temporarily less healthy when you give blood. It's actually the only way to lower your iron stores, which is one of the big reasons for oxidizing in the body and recommendations of antioxidants.

              This is why it is recommended you (and post menopausal women) don't take supplements with iron.

              Therefore, by giving someone else health, you are actually receive immediate health benefits in return.

    11. The Cure - It's Never Enough 🙂
      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N5enlLwo94M

      However much I push it down
      It's never enough
      However much I push it around
      It's never enough
      However much I make it out
      It's never enough
      Never enough
      However much I do

      However big I ever feel
      It's never enough
      Whatever I do to make it real
      It's never enough
      In any way I try to speak
      It's never enough
      Never enough
      However much I try to speak
      It's never enough

      However much I'm falling down
      It's never enough
      However much I'm falling out
      It's never enough
      Whatever smile I smile the most
      It's never enough
      Never enough
      However I smile
      I smile the most

      So let me hold it up
      Just one more go
      Holding it up for just once more
      One more time to fill it up
      One more time to kill
      But whatever I do
      It's never enough
      It's never enough

      It's never enough

    12. Hi mr Randy G.Xubava tema,kakto vinagi,vie ste dobar trenior.Mislia ,che zdraveto i parite sa svarzani.Zdraveto e v osnovata na stastie ,obich,lubov...Parite iskat risk,naxodchivost,darzost,a tova saotvetstva samo pri zdravi xora,no ne izkluchvam i kasmeta.Niakoi kazvat niama kasmet,ima mnogo trud.Ama poniakoga mnogo se trudish i nisto ne se poluchava.Kakvo mislite za roliata na kasmeta.Kakvo e kasmet-dobro mislene ili....no sam sigyrna che v vsichko stoi zdraveto...

    13. I guess this also leads to the question:

      "Is greed for anything, good or bad?"

      Lets start with looking it up in the dictionary:

      Greed: intense and selfish desire for something, esp. wealth, power or food

      What's bad about that? Nothing i'd say. Isn't it great to have 'intense desires'? Not to me. I like them... they make me feel alive.

      "But what about 'selfish'?", some people will probably say. "Isn't that bad?"

      Seems that the word "selfish" (again) plays a major role here (this great blog/world). Lets look that up:

      Selfish: concerned above all with one's own profit or pleasure.

      I hope everybody agrees that 'Being concerned about one's profit and pleasure' is a great thing. (Except when you believe the "profit is bad" or "pleasure is for the devil" meme. Who put these in our collective brains? Maybe some (selfish?) institution that wanted it (profit and pleasure) all for themselfs for centuries? )

      So what about the "above all" part? Imho 'Above all' doesnt exclude something. It just tells what comes 'first'. And here we are back again to Ayn Rand's philosophy.
      And Jesus' philosophy too? "love your neighbour like you love yourself"? Doesnt that also mean that you first have to love yourself, before you can love others? So 'above all', you have to love yourself.

      It kinda all revolves around the meaning you give to (and how you feel about) a few words and concepts: selfish, profit, pleasure, above all... and money of course. But arent those meanings meme's in itself too? Have we ever questioned our meanings/feelings of words? I think we should. Accepting that the same word can mean different things to other people can prevent some fights and wars.

      Lets all get 'brainwashed' from those infectious mind meme's and start communicating with feelings!

      I just realised that I didnt address the "Is having a desire for money different from having a desire for love, health...?"-question yet.

      Anyway... these were my thoughts about greed 😉

      What is money? Money is used to exchange value. Money is perceived value. The dictionary about 'Value:' the importance or preciousness of something. So a rich person would have more 'value' than a poor one. That would make him or her more important or precious? Off course not. So its clearly our perception of value and the 'value' of money that can create an issue.

      Here is the imbalance that leads to much confusion: Someone is not a more 'valuable' person because he or she has more money. If you feel /think that a person with more money than you is more 'valuable' than you, it is logical you resent (and fight) that. This is a dangerous meme. We all are created equal, so we all have the same 'value'. I think too much 'value' is being given to money. Nothing has more value. All is equal: energy in an infinite field. Its all about experience and perception. Value is just a tag, but given too much emphasis can create imbalance in people and societies.

      It's all made up of the same energy that is all around us.

      Hey... am I ranting here?! 🙂

      Guess the big question is: why are we here? next post? 😉

      Eric from The Netherlands

    14. When my friend pays $400k cash for an AMG Benz, I know people are asking: "Does he really need a car that expensive?". The answer of course is no, he doesn't NEED it. My only question is: "When are we going for a spin?". Randy's point is so clear and succinct, a perfect analogy, yet people have allowed themselves to self-limit and make excuses as to why we're not supposed to be prosperous. Which is exactly why they aren't. Thanks Randy for the insight and clarity, once again.

      Greg

    15. Great post/thought Randy,
      It seems like to me that some are either to focused on arguing for the sake of arguing or caught up in the symantics of money vs. wealth, really we need to make a distinction between the two? Would it have been any different if it had been phrased- Can you ever have to much wealth?
      As to the "percieved value" point of view I know this to be another false distinction, the land+building being worth more is not percieved value it is real value. Why? Because of two things
      1- Some one is willing to pay more for the developed land than the cost of the land plus the cost of the materials to build therefore it is not perceived value it is true value. The buyer says "Yep that's what it is worth" not well I perceive it to have this or that value.
      2- The cost is not simply a matter of x+y=z, rather x+y+(knowledge to make it work+labor+time+++)=Z- Doubt wealth grows from nearly nothing? Think silca sand circa 1947 vs. that same sand used in a microchip today. It's perceived value did not change. It is its true value that changed.

      1. If it is true value and not perceived value then why does it change in a Boom or a recession?. If it was true value then surely it would never change?

        If someone builds 10 more hotels next door and they all go up for sale at the same time the buyers will perceive them all to be worth less and will make an offer dependent on their perception of what it is worth to them. The first hotel is the same but the price will be reduced.

        To know somethings value it always has to be compared to something else. Even a fake story in the local news about toxic waste on the site could drop the price.

          1. Thanks for the discussion Bones. It is fun to think about and clarify all of these points. You bring up very important questions that make understanding money much easier.
            I wasn't as clear in my own head about all this till you brought up the questions.
            Nothing beats a good, fun debate when we are all looking for better solutions. Especially when the subject is money 🙂

            1. I agree- I'm here to learn, so when something doesn't feel right to me, I want to clarify and ask, question, and re-ask until it does.

              I think I'm seen as argumentative (maybe I am), but it's from a sincere desire to learn.

              "If two people agree on everything, one of them isn't necessary"

              Well, that goes for an entire forum too!

      2. Russ- I agree with you- using the term wealth might be better- it's not semantics at all; it's really being clear with our communication, and I'm not arguing- I am asking how they are the same.

        1- You say "someone", but there may be no one, and then it is valueless. If no one values that developed land, then it's worth ZERO. There's no such thing as inherent value (expect for maybe people)

        2- No- a microchip is USELESS unless someone wants it. Ask someone in the middle of that same desert whether or not they'd rather have a the newest microchip or a glass of clean water- you'll see perceived value instantly.

    16. Juicy topic Randy! It sure does get a response from people. And W David C - fantastic comments! People infected with the meme about hogging money lose and squander their wealth courtesy of the law of attraction, which draws two types of people together - one that doesn't believe they deserve the money that they have and another one that believes that they deserve MORE than they have. If we generate wealth by the ideas in our mind and other people create wealth by the ideas in their minds, we cannot possibly be taking the wealth of others away when we attract and accumulate more for ourselves.

    17. @Bones The labor of love starts from within. When you are passionate about doing something you give your work your life energy. Its like a farmer sowing a seed. He is just not throwing it. There is an expectation within for the crop to grow and produce fruit. And this expectation within him motivates him to take care of the crop at all stages of growth. Money is not a paper that is printed and kept outside for you to go and grab it. It is something that you bring forth to yourself through the passion within you. 🙂

      1. We are not talking about labors of love, we are not talking about passion- we are talking about whether or not money and health are the same thing.

        I understand that IN THEORY, you do something with love and passion, it creates something great, and then the world is better off, and then IF you get around to charging for it for some reason, THEN you make money- I get that.

        If you never charge for it, you never make a dime, even though you may love it and the world is better off, and you have increased the "wealth" of the world- if you don't say "You now owe me", you never make a dime.

        1. Brother Bones, I appreciate your sincerity, your vitality and passion for life. Might be you are looking for a change of pace and place. Travel or getaway will be a good idea. Fill yourself up to fullness so you can overflow.

    18. and the passions and motivation can give us energy that needs for health building. I would like to say I just remember the pain of poverty when I cannot afford to buy vitamins and foods, it sucks!. I don't really want it anyway. When I have money for myself, and give a tremendous amount of effort to create paintings, do better in a job, not supplying my mind of infectious negative meme about money, from within, my health recovered. after a year, my mother said to me, you are looking healthy..

    19. Wow! Randy, I know that you want us to be critique thinkers and all that... but this time I do not have nothing but to agree and smile for the great and simple way you put something like this!!!

      I love it... We recognize the "success" of someone who achieve good health, but blame someone who achieve wealth.

      Thank you.

    20. Hi Randy,

      Very good point. I never looked at this idea in this way before. I do know people who are in poor health who are jealous of others in good health and wonder what they've done to deserve their situation. But they certainly don't think that the healthy individual is being greedy.

      I just started your Midas Mentality program and have read the Prosperity Series. I am discovering lots of new ways of thinking. I also discovered a victim (damsel in distress) mindset that I was completely unaware of previously.

      Thanks for sharing!

      Ellen

    21. Ok, money is an exchange tool for something you value. Let's say for energy. And energy is becoming in short supply isn't it? Wrong, it isn't. Just the way we think about it. Did you know that to equal the energy consumption to the amount of energy the sun dumps on our little blue happy lump of matter we have to use per person the equivalent of 1.5 small scale nuclear plants? And that is just on our planet. The vast majority of the energy the sun generates (generates?! What happened to E=MC2) dispersed into space. And how many other planets do the same? So there is NO shortage of energy at all, just a problem with our thinking about it. So maybe the value of energy (and thus the money we pay for it) is zilch since it is in such abundant supply. Hey, what about our thoughts?! Aren't they a form of energy? So yes, it is all in our minds and our minds are capable of anything.
      Unfortunately, our minds are trained in scarcity thinking. And thus, we think that earning a lot is taking away from others when there is absolutely no need for that.

    22. There are a finite amount of resources on planet Earth.

      The world population is heading towards 9 billion.

      If one hoards more of the Earth's finite resources than he needs, others' needs are left unfulfilled.

      Only those with 'more than enough' wealth are able to hoard more finite resources than they need.

      In a dog-eat-dog world, where hoarding more finite resources than you need is considered 'success,' you end up with a world of a few fat dogs, and lots and lots of dead and wounded dogs.

      Our Joe from above is unable to hoard his health, or love - those are already his and his alone. However, if Joe hoarded more 'health credits' and 'love credits' than he needed, thereby depriving his neighbors of health and love, I think his neighbors would be pretty damn pissed off at Joe...

    23. Money talks .

      We can do lots of lovely things with money that can't be done without it, I think some people are against it because they need to make changes in themselves in order to attract money and it's kind of scary for them.

      I love the way you do these kind of challenging thinking.

      Good luck

    24. Just last night my husband and I were at the store. As we were getting our items scanned we were chatting with the clerk and somehow we got to singing a little of "I want to be a billionaire"... the clerk laughed with us and said, "Yeah, right! But with lots of money comes lots of problems!" She obviously decided that we'd agree with that and somehow that would make it alright to continue living a lack oriented life. We countered with, "with a lot of money, you pay people to deal with many of the "perceived" problems. You jet off somewhere and enjoy your life. You drive the car of your dreams. You live in the house that you love and you have more then enough to deal with anything that comes your way."

      It was so obvious that thoughts like this had never occurred to the young lady. At one time in our lives, they hadn't occurred to us either.

      So glad we attracted mentors like Randy and many others into our lives to help us let go of these societal mind viruses!!!

      Tiffany

    25. Frank, how many Boeing 747's where there on planet earth when dinosaurs roamed the earth?

      If you you answered "zero", well, where did they came from then?

      All the materials have already been around us for ever. Mankind just needed the cumulative ideas of making steel and alloys, electricity, plastics, etc. And of course the meme 'man cannot fly' had to be shattered by the Wright brothers.

      Also, 300 years ago, the elite's standards of living was lower than John Doe who lives on well fare today. Think a house with windows, electricity, phone, internet. Think health care and community services like police, fire department, public transportation etc.

      We've been able to raise standards of living for everybody. It's and-and, not either-or:

      Let's say I have fruit trees and vegetables in my garden and have more than I need for myself. And let's say you a great teacher and are free in the weekends.
      Now we can trade: I provide your family fresh fruits and vegetables, and in exchange you tutor my kids in the weekends.

      My guess is that you consider fruit, vegetables and tutors to be finite. But in my example, both our livestyles go up, without depleting any resource.

      By saying "If one hoards more of the Earth’s finite resources than he needs, others’ needs are left unfulfilled.", you imply that there is EXACTLY enough for everybody.
      If I "hoard" 100 cans of tuna - in stead of just the two I'm going to eat for dinner, how do you know someone is dying of hunger?
      If I "hoard" 25 suits - in stead of just 1, how do you know someone else is walking the streets naked?
      If I have two cars, one for the family and one sports car for fun, how do you know some is car-less?

      - Robert

      1. Wow I've missed a lot here! Isn't the whole point of studying prosperity that we are learning to create our own reality?

        I'm choosing to create the reality where there is unlimited money, health and good stuff for everyone. If you focus on the limitation it will show up for you. That's more or less what I've learned and I'm finding it to be true for me!

    26. To question whether health, love, money, happiness, or anything for that matter, is finite is in my opinion a way to express a frustration that lies within. The ability or need to question it is the human mind getting in the way. In other words, stop worrying about it and the balance will find itself without you getting in the way.

    27. I am not yet wealthy, I took the" work hard, get a good education, get a good job" pill and have some work to do to dig out of the student debt hole, but here's my perception with wealth.

      Paper assets are paper assets, they decrease in value as they're printed, but wealthy people buy things with inherent value. They trade it in for land, property and commodities of inherent value, and they spend the paper assets on things they enjoy in the moment (the cars, the fine restaurants, they skybox seats, etc), this makes sense to spend because the spending power is always decreasing when not invested elsewhere in wealth building assets. Most people earn a dollar, spend $1.25, and lean on others to make up the difference when their bill finally comes due.

      Now you can take the lottery ticket approach and make your money vanish, or you can take a different approach. Many wealthy families have vast art collections or antique collections, they'll hold a % in metals, some invest in fine wines or classic cars. They also hold value in equities/brands/stocks that then create more income for them. Their paper assets have now turned into longlasting value in the equity they create and the credit opportunities they create (home equity lines of credit, etc) which then can be used to fund and leverage further sources of income and equity or add to everyday enjoyment of your life.

    28. Money is infinite. Health is infinite. Energy is infinite. The universe is infinite. Love is infinite. Ideas are infinite.

      It is never too much. Prosperity is infinite.

      Thanks for a very thought provoking post.

    29. All these B.S. (belief system) I am reading may come from one meme - The Law Of Scarcity we were taught in economics. For the past four hundred years, virtually all practitioners of the dismal science we call economics have agreed on one basic premise: namely that a society's wealth is determined by its supply of physical resources--its land, labor, minerals, water, and so on. And underlying this premise has been another, even more profound, assumption--one supposedly so obvious that it is rarely mentioned: namely, that the entire world contains a limited amount of these physical resources.

      This means, from an economic point of view, that life is what the mathematicians call a zero-sum game. After all, if there are only limited resources, one person's gain must be another person's loss; the richer one person is, the poorer his neighbors must be. Over the centuries, this view of the world has been responsible for innumerable wars, revolutions, political movements, government policies, business strategies, and possibly a religion or two.

      We do not live in a resource-scarce environment. That may seem hard to believe, but the businessperson and the politician--as well as the butcher, the baker, and the candlestick maker--who
      continue to behave as if they were operating in the old zero-sum world will soon find themselves eclipsed by those who recognize the new realities and react accordingly.

      In the alchemic world in which we now live, a society's wealth is still a function of its physical resources, as traditional economics has long maintained. But unlike the outdated economist, the alchemist of today recognizes that technology controls both the definition and the supply of physical resources. In fact, for the past few decades, it has been the backlog of unimplemented technological advances, rather than unused physical resources, that has been the determinant of real growth.

    30. Rodriguez,I think you think you are too smart for anything or anyone. But do you know that God says, you can have everything, in abundance, whether it's health or money. Everything, is EVERYTHING. You know why? So you can bless others.
      If you are poor, broke, sick or lacking, how are you supposed to bless others? You can't! You gotta take care of yourself first and that starts by inviting God into your life, accepting Christ as your number one. Then, asking God what HIS will is for your life. I tell you this though, God will bless you, so you can bless others.
      Having money & wealth can be used as a tool to help others.

    31. "I will engage in no transaction which does not benefit all whom it affects"

      As long as you keep that oath then keep the money coming....You are only doing good by making it!!!!

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