We’re continuing the discussion from the post on How Much is Enough? Russ had some great points on money versus wealth and the real value we assign things. And that is the point some of you aren’t getting.
David asks, “If it is true value and not perceived value then why does it change in a Boom or a recession? If it were true value then surely it would never change? If someone builds 10 more hotels next door and they all go up for sale at the same time, the buyers will perceive them all to be worth less and will make an offer dependent on their perception of what it is worth to them. The first hotel is the same but the price will be reduced. Even a fake story in the local news about toxic waste on the site could drop the price.”
But that is the point EXACTLY…
Follow me here: Let’s say two people are thinking about buying a hotel. We’ll call them “Bones” and “Randy.” 🙂
The guy we call “Bones” watches the news every night and sees the fake story about toxic waste. This fits perfectly into his worldview that all big corporations are greedy entities that plunder the environment and he decides not to buy the hotel.
The guy we call “Randy” hears about the story, but checks it out and realizes it’s false. He believes the hotel is still a great value for the money and buys it. The area continues to develop, legalizes gambling five years later, and Randy sells his hotel to Donald Trump for a $20 million profit.
We track down the Bones guy and we find him drinking in a pub, commiserating about how the rich people conspire to take money from the pockets of the poor. He’ll offer the hotel deal as proof. But he actually had the same opportunity. However his consciousness – his subconscious fundamental beliefs about money and other forms of prosperity – clouded his vision and caused him to miss the opportunity.
As James Allen tells us, the outer world of circumstance shapes itself to the inner world of thought. It’s okay to be skeptical. Everyone should do their due diligence before any large financial decision. But never confuse cynicism with skepticism. If you have a cynical view of the world, if you expect people to screw you and expect bad things to happen, that is exactly what you attract.
This happens because you see yourself as a victim, so your subconscious mind causes you to take actions that keep you in victimhood. I did this for 30 years.
In my case, it was because I had such low self-esteem. I didn’t like myself and the only thing that made me feel better was when I subconsciously put myself in situations where I could be the victim. This made me feel noble and right.
So what about you? Do you revel in victimhood because it makes you feel better? Are you only happy when you’re unhappy?
In the follow up post Are You Sabotaging Your Prosperity?, the real Bones said, “Randy asked a question…I answered that question…And now I’m a broke, anti-prosperity communist?”
My experience of you Bones would cause me to answer, “No you’re not a broke anti-prosperity Communist. You’d just be happier if you were.” So please just swish that around a bit and see where it takes you. Just see if you feel you have a worldview that may be causing you to miss out on some prosperity you should be getting.
As for the rest of you…
Before anyone gloats or thinks today’s post is “Randy gets even with Bones” day, it isn’t. Bones asked some great questions and brought a lot of this discussion to light. Give him credit for challenging me, having conviction, and not being afraid to go against the grain. He is honestly trying to get his head around the issue and he has the courage to ask the tough questions that he hopes will get him there.
There were many other comments that reek of lack programming and prejudice about money and wealth. And that’s exactly where we’ll pick up on the next post!
I'm glad you brought up the question of cynicism and skepticism. There are 2 things that I have seen people do frequently and which I have done in my own ignorance.
The first is disguising the inability and unwillingness to change or explore things outside of the comfort zone by calling it skepticism. You notice that some people are skeptical only about certain things.
The second is indulging in cynicism under the guise of being a skeptic. Instead of not making your mind up about something, in reality, you have already established a worldview that doesn't serve you.
Randy, I am really enjoying your prosperity blog posts and you're helping me stretch my mind outside of the comfort zone.
As I gain an understanding of Allen's take I realize the importance of monitoring your thoughts, and more importantly, feelings, moment by moment. Some of the statements in the comments made me cringe, which was a good thing. Of course the lack and limitation takes did this 😉
As for skepticism even that word can be dangerous if taken the wrong way. I think in terms of being open-minded yet discerning. Sometimes skeptics close doors before they have the chance to be fully opened.
An open mind gets raped.
Glad to see you're not cynical!
Seriously? You get what you expect, dude.
“Despite a voluminous and often fervent literature on "income distribution," the cold fact is that income is not distributed: It is earned.” - Thomas Sowell
“Government “help” to business is just as disastrous as government persecution… the only way a government can be of service to national prosperity is by keeping its hands off.” – Ayn Rand
To prove it, check out the GDP – Per Capita (PPP) for the country of Liechtenstein in Europe:
I like how you attribute the debate between perceived value and actual value to cynicism. I agree a hundred percent. this subjective world view of the nonexistence of real value or of personal property could only stem from a cynical mind. one that has been steeped in the indoctrination of the spiritually destitute. they are poor, but at least they are happy.....right?
I think the hardest part of personal growth, is recognizing you are a cynic. I believe the problem Mr. bones has is that he is unaware of the fact that he has this subjective view. he is a cynic. he will defend tooth and nail that he is not a money hating, anti capitalist lackmonger. he doesn't realize that he revealed the problem with the statement of value being arbitrary and subjective.
don't they always say the first step is recognizing the problem?
this is why people like him are struggling with understanding what you mean. you can't explain it any clearer. it doesn't make sense because they are not programmed to understand it.
Hopefully, blogs like these will set the proper path.
keep it up ole boy
Let's not make this gang up on Bones day. But you have some good points.
"They are not programmed to understand it" yet let's not forget that they can re-program their subconscious which is what they are doing by asking the tough questions.
I really like Ryan's positioning of discerning. I perhaps bring my own baggage to the concepts of "cynical" and "skeptic." To me, those who are known for being so have a chip on their shoulders. They come into a situation with a default sense that what they are seeing or observing is stupid, unworthy, or likely to be untrue unless convinced.
Discernment on the other hand...seems to me to be coming from a place of strength. You are open, but you are experienced. You know the indicators that should be investigated...the red flags that rise up for you under certain conditions. Discernment shows a well evolved sense of wisdom in how to perceive and respond to circumstances. That, to me, is a great trait to develop. It fights lack thinking yet also guards against arrogance. Discernment is a powerful thing we can all aspire to have more off. You can't have too much discernment. But you can have too much skepticism.
Spot on! Thank you for your comment. My thinking has been going in such a direction, but I really needed someone to verbalize it:)
It's a tough cookie to crack, but once you get there...awesome!
Great post, keeps me on my toes!
I need to go off point for a moment to comment briefly on your post from the other day, "The Energy You Send Out".
You really made me stop to think about what I am offering back to people that I want in my life. Value for value as you say.
With that I must apologize for expecting you to just offer up sage or other types of advice to me with no expectation of something in return. You are a great friend who has offered me advice concerning my opera company and offered advice on other situations. I will never take that for granted again!
Thank you so much for your friendship and mentoring over the years. Thanks to you, I am now keenly aware of what value I will bring to a new relationship that I hope to grow with people I desire to be around. And that includes you! I truly appreciate all that you do!
Thank you again.
With love and gratitude,
Lucinda 'The Opera Diva'
Go Bones Go!
"If you have an apple and I have an apple and we exchange apples then you and I will still each have one apple. But if you have an idea and I have an idea and we exchange these ideas, then each of us will have two ideas." -- George Bernard Shaw
You are right Randy when you say
'but that is the point EXACTLY'
I was not sure why you added the "BUT"
because that was the point I was making EXACTLY......
The comment I made was in response to a comment Russ made that said
"As to the “percieved value” point of view I know this to be another false distinction, the land+building being worth more is not percieved value it is real value..
When the truth is "nothing has any real value". If it did then the price would never change.
Markets and prices are changed based on many factors, mostly supply and demand. And what we think it is worth to us, not what it is really worth.
The Fake story in the news would put off potential buyers and because less people want to buy the Hotel the price would drop. This would make it a better deal and it could be picked up at a lower price than if lots more people were bidding on it.
It is just simple economics that nothing has any real value and that the price will change depending on supply and demand.
That is why properties that I was looking to buy years ago are now half price. Absolute bargains now because they finally produce positive cash flow every month rather than a negative cash flow.
If we add an example it will make it clearer.
Lets ask Russ how much real value a bottle of ice cold water has. He may say £1
So we test this out by going to a group of people who are living beside a clean, fresh water river and try to sell it to them. They would probably laugh and say that it is worthless to them. The value is now £0
Take this same bottle of water to the desert and meet up with 10 Billionaire Arabs who have not seen water in days and are almost dying of thirst. How much value does that same bottle of water have. It would probably sell easily for £50,000.
If this bottle of water has real value then it should be worth £1 in each situation.
Randy, I may be wrong about this. If so, could you clarify and I would be very grateful.
Sounds logical to me.
Sounds logical, but that doesn't make it totally correct. Just like correctly completing a math equation but plugging in the wrong values for variables will yield the wrong answer. Just because something's perceived value can change doesn't mean it lacks real value. The cup of ice water may not be that attractive to the stream dwellers, some engineering genius both invented the device that forms water Into cold cubes, and made an apparatus to hold it. It's value most certainly isn't zero. This is a situation objectivism would refer to as simply needing to only exercise within context. You cannot adhere to the premise of value being an absolute and drop contexts. The absolute value os that which promotes mans life. The water has real value anywhere in that context. Currency exchange will differ based on the supply wd demane, but real value Is not void.
Great article Randy,
It is OK to be skeptical, but cynics poison. Like you said, "Randy" checked the information out. This alleviated the skepticism, & provided a great ROI. "Bones" being the example of the cynic, believed the news at face value b/c it aligned with his limiting beliefs. He would have been at that pub anyway!
Thank you RG for dividing the "Bones" & "Marrow" of this subject.
Thanks to the real Bones for being such a great sport & asking thought provoking questions.
Interesting discussion. I would offer that if greed is not in play or in your consciousness that prospertiy and abundance have a much better chance of manifesting. As for "lack programming", it's important to point out that subconscious programming is not always recognized on a conscious level, and it is the point of attraction. So if things keep showing up that you don't want, it would be wise to seek counsel of some sort to bring that up and out. That's a process, normally, it doesn't happen overnight. I find that negative programming, requires constant thought monitoring, like being your own hall monitor. It's work, but if you keep "erasing and replacing" pretty soon the new thought process takes hold. Cynics, have developed that attitude because it's less painful to have low expectations of others, than to have higher ones and be disappointed. Skeptics, are about a step away from that. You do your research, you evaluate, pick up the vibes from who is offering it, keep your karma clean, and you should be able do the deal based on your gut. Just my two million on this topic.
Hey!!! I JUST saw this- I was out working with some kids today on Improvisation and leadership skills-
I bet some of you find that hilarious!
Yeah, some big company is raping me for my knowledge so they can take more money and stick it to the poor....
Randy- Thanks for protecting me from "Bash Bones Day"- I appreciate it.
Hey- I think I DEFINITELY border the line close to cynic at times- DEFINITELY.
Actually- here's how cynical I can be- when I was reading about the "fake news story" above, I thought "Actually, that's a great way to make sure you get the property at a discount; by making up a fake story about toxic waste- I'll bet that happens all the time!"
It's really funny, I have an entire room of prosperity and self-help books, and I spout ALL of it very often to a lot of people. In case you haven't realized I am well-versed in the literature when we discuss it.
My ebook for actors is ALL "you can do anything" and "crisis and opportunity are the same thing" etc.
However, I do not accept it all as unvarnished Gospel Truth. I believe that there are such things as circumstances, and exceptions to rules.
In this forum, I see the philosophy of prosperity (for lack of a better term; although it makes one hell of a book title!) being used as DOGMA. Dogma that's inescapable like the worst parts of religions.
And I think Dogma is the worst human invention.
So, yeah, I get upset and feel like there's someone to protect (myself?) from being told what to believe "or else".
I feel like I constantly hear "Think EXACTLY like this, or you'll be broke, sick and miserable all your life", and I lash out at it, or feel the need to interject what I see as the exception.
I AM looking for the adjustments to unlock ever more prosperity, but I believe there is a fine line between agreement and dogmatic Kool-Aid drinking worship.
Ex. I take issue with the "Thought leaders" who say the people in the towers on 9-11 were thinking thoughts of death.
(The subtext I hear is "So watch your thoughts, or the terrorists will get you too!")
I think we are ALL responsible for creating 9-11 collectively, just as we are ALL responsible for creating the imbalance of wealth (In case you didn't know where I was going).
I AGREE that prosperity is all around us, and I agree that when we create value for people we are rewarded in some fashion.
But I vehemently DISAGREE with the "LAWS" of prosperity as being "natural laws" like gravity, and with all of the dogmatic statements I hear here sometimes.
I'm all about recognizing opportunity to provide value for other people. The score-keeping part I admit I don't understand too well; It seems to me to be so arbitrary that it's ridiculous.
I like paying for some extravagant things because I believe someone is making my life better.
But guess what- there ARE big corporations that conspire to take money from anywhere it can get it.
-Cigarette companies DO sell poison that gets you hooked on it purposefully for the sole purpose of profit.
So, when I hear that "Money is only earned through providing real value to people" I don't see that as Gospel Truth.
When I hear "Yeah, but cigarette (or any) companies who do evil don't last for the long haul" that doesn't square with reality. It DOES however square with that DOGMA.
So, I believe that somewhere in between the dogma and the cynicism is the truth, and I am looking for it,
and am willing to be bashed for a bit to find it.
Thanks for reading (this is long, I think), and I appreciate your patience.
Thanks for commenting as you did Bones. I will own up crossing the line and getting dogmatic sometimes. As most of you know, I have very fervent beliefs on prosperity because of a couple things.
First, these things have really worked well for me, so I get impatient when people that don't have things working well debate me about them. I once did a workshop for professional speakers and had a guy in the audience arguing over almost every point I said. I was booked out for two years at $25,000 a speech and he had no bookings for $500. Finally I said something to the effect of, "I live in a nicer house than you, drive nicer cars, and wear nicer clothes than you do. So you need to just shut up and listen, or leave." Patience and humility were not my strong suits.
Second, I spent so many years broke and in victimhood, there is a definite emotional charge to those memories. So it's easy for me to channel that energy and state things as unequivocal, which borders closely to dogma.
I hate dogma and doctrines myself, so I understand your aversion to them as well.
One important note: I don't believe that money is only earned by providing value. But I do believe true prosperity is only manifested by providing true value.
"I don’t believe that money is only earned by providing value. But I do believe true prosperity is only manifested by providing true value."
Then we totally agree, and when I come across as negative, I am not expressing myself well. In the last few days I've been trying to separate money and value in this discussion.
I am a passionate believer myself, in whatever it is I believe at the moment. 😉
Because I wrote this "Dating Book" (Although it's not really), I was invited to speak at a seminar for "pick-up Artists".
One guru had a philosophy of "If you wanna get pu$$y, you gotta treat bit**e$ like $h!t".
He and I had a vehement difference of opinion about that.
He THOUGHT I was advocating the "Nice guy" philosophy, which is a super-no-no in the pick-up artist world (as it should be, by the way), and his ace in the hole comment was "Well, I got 6 lays this week- how many did you?"
Being extremely happily married, I had no answer-
I wasn't even sure I could claim the one! LOL!!!!
However, OBVIOUSLY, I had to get across the point that although there are DEFINITELY women who will only sleep with guys who treat them like $hit, and his advice wasn't actually WRONG, it wasn't hard-and-fast 100% Gospel truth either.
I have a feeling you guys will agree with me here.
The extra layer to that story is that the guy was EXTREMELY good looking, confident, had a TON of money and connections, and had learned the SKILL of flirting and attraction. He was attributing ALL his success with women to this "Treat 'em like Bit**$" philosophy, and totally disregarding all of these other things that added to his "lays".
Sooooo, whereas here I might seem to be a pinko-commie-hippie, (a no-no in a capitalistic forum- as it should be) I'm not.
I'm saying that all of this prosperity talk isn't necessarily Gospel Truth either, despite great results like some rockin' wardrobe, homes and cars.
I'm saying that maybe there might be some other things- in addition to a philosophy- that bring money (not true prosperity and value!) into one's life.
So, I am usually just reacting to what I see as dogma. Thanks again for listening.
Randy, can I have a cyber-hug now? I heard on some blog that they're infinitely available...
LOL. I can't say anything else.
Bones, you definitely have my style of coaching. I now also see why some people don't always like it. But it works for me!!! 😉
This has been one of my favorite interactions ever! Thanks for putting yourself out there so fervently and honestly.
Bravo bones. The defense from the standppoint of not accepting properity "laws" as a dogma was intellectually a great point.
Randy Gage...you are the man!
Lets book a Caribbean Cruise for all of us to celebrate this episode. We are one great family 😉
What a fantastic train of thought. All of it.
You know Mr Gage - what I love about more than anything (maybe) is that you're willing to do anything for those you love to get them to wake up - EVEN if it's calling them out publically. EVEN when it's embarassing.
I adore that about you! Your love for those you care about is more important than being nice/good.
The critical mind plays tricks, I am with you on discerning "cynicism" and "skepticism" and here is what comes up for me:
-we learn by something that happened before in the past. Is it going to happen again? We don't know. A dog bites you. All dogs bite, that's what you learn. But all dogs don't bite.
-Consciously re-programming your beliefs and opening up to "what might be great" can awaken that knowledge we all have
-Further investigation without an open-ness to the outcome can lift you up
-Also, what is new is by its nature scary because we haven't ever been on this planet, at this time, with all these tools in front of us and it's easier to stick with old tools than fully embrace new ones that may or may not work
What I like about Randy is he steps up and blazes trails and that makes it less scary for me
I like this short Post Erica, and i think you're super-right about learning from pain..
"All dogs bite" isn't true, so to behave as if it were true would make one miss out on all the great things that dogs can offer.
At the same time, and no less true, is that some dogs DO bite (actually they ALL bite, but circumstances, etc), so we SHOULD use some discernment, right?
Just like love, money, blah, blah, blah!
One question...when I see myself as a victim, what exactly is it that I see?No, I am serious.It could help(me) to change it.I feel it, but I cannot exactly say what it is.Maybe you can?I guess it is different situations for most of us.But the feeling is the same!Is it an "archetype`?Thanks again for great posts!